October 19, 2003
Board Meeting, Sunday, October 19, 2003.
Session Start: Sun Oct 19 13:02:03 2003
(Brent) I call the meeting to order - it's 15 past the hour.
(Roger) Whoops, that one doesn't work.
(NancyL) Roger, try zetatalk3.com
(Brent) Item 1 Minutes of last meeting. Comment or questions
(NancyL) OH! Oct1903a.htm
(Roger) Not there either.
(Roger) No comments re the last meeting minutes
(Roger) hehehe, October, right!
(SteveH) it works for me
(SteveH) I would like to bring up last years Q report, status please? (just kidding hehe)
(NancyL) Am I off line?
(NancyL) Back (phew)
(SteveH) no comments
(Brent) Any further comment or questions on item 1?
(NancyL) None here!
(Roger) none here
(Brent) OK, the minutes are ratified as correct.
(Brent) Item 2 - Jan's resignations....discussion & vote.
(NancyL) None here.
(SteveH) no comments
(Roger) Should we further address his veiled implication of wrong doing in reference to our accounting?
(Brent) I was thinking so.
(NancyL) Rog, my opinion is that we beat that to death already. The only thing I did not list recently is the assets, and this list has not changed in the last two years.
(SteveH) I think Nancy addressed that pretty thoroughly on tt-inc the other week
(Roger) Personally, I think we have done more than enough and I find it interesting that he was not up to the challenge of serving the board and the membership rather than his own personal agenda.
(NancyL) Wegner depreciated it by 10% and expensed a lot of little stuff (their policy), and I depreciated it all again end of 2002.
(NancyL) All this was links off the agenda in past, no change.
(Roger) And we all agreed to it several meetings ago.
(Roger) I move we accept Jan's resignation as Internal Auditor, Vice President, and member of the Board of Directors.
(NancyL) I second the motion.
(Brent) Since this meeting will be posted (log & minutes) to the public, and Jan will be referencing it for his future comments, it is important to reference the links to the financial data for public reference. Are the links current Nancy?
(NancyL) The links from the last few meetings, yes, and all links in the past work. If you like, I can work up a list of the current assets, from the past, current value, and post this as a link from the Minutes.
(NancyL) This was the only nit he was requesting, technically, that the Bylaws state. End of 2002, asset list, value.
(NancyL) I will also find where this was listed in the past, a link to that, historical ref.
(Brent) Good idea Nancy.
(Brent) As I mentioned in the last meeting, the board has been in total agreement with the accounting records, and has found no flaws, errors, or misrepresentation. Nancy, you have done a great job of keeping the records.
(Brent) OK, we have a motion & second for a vote. Agree to accept Jan's resignation, vote yes, opposed no
(Brent) Shirley= yes
(Brent) thank you :-)
(Brent) The motion carries, Jan's resignation accepted.
(Brent) Item 3 REview of changes to the nonprofit
(NancyL) I made the changes to the Bylaws, Mission Statement re removing pole shift, as reviewed by the Membership etc.
(NancyL) I made no changes to the booklet.
(Roger) other than the removal of references to the pole shift as the primary cause for earth changes, there really hasn't been much change
(NancyL) To my knowledge, there are not suggestions from the Membership for new projects, right?
(SteveH) is that for the online PDF bookelt?
(NancyL) I think many are focused on the current earth changes and kind of holding their breath.
(NancyL) Yes, Steve, which is the same one we print. Based on Mike L
(NancyL) 's request to consider that pole shift IS severe earth changes, etc it should be included.
(Roger) Other than Mike L's suggestions, we've heard very little from the membership or our consultants (TT-forum)
(SteveH) my opinion would be to leave pole shift in as is
(NancyL) The board last week decided to just leave that in, as the booklet just includes it in alist of worrysome things, no date assigned.
(Roger) Well, it has already been removed from the website.
(Roger) And there were no direct references to it in the booklet so the booklet hasn't changed.
(Brent) The only suggested project came from Mike L with discussion on TT-Forum regarding Voluntary CD backup of survival info in the whole TT website.
(NancyL) Yes, I updated the Mission Statement, as required. It just says a list of earth changes, not pole shift.
(NancyL) Brent, this has come up now and then, folks asking for a CD of the content of the TT web site, which is immense and SO worthy, truly.
(NancyL) I think if we had a CD, duping it is not difficult!
(NancyL) The main problem with just doing something like a web whack is that there are so many external links.
(Roger) True, but do we then request a donation to defray shipping costs?
(NancyL) These would have to be snubbed, as we could not print other web site contents, not owning them, etc.
(NancyL) TT is considered public domain, no worry.
(NancyL) Roger, it may also be possible to put this on the web site, but a CD holds a heck of a lot of stuff.
(Roger) And a
(Roger) DVD holds gigs!
(NancyL) I think the same would apply. CD's cost blank about $1.50 or some such, cheap, and many PCs have duplicating abiity, burn CD's we have this here.
(Brent) Roger, folk were going to do this on their own, not buy one from us. BUT - the content of the website will not fit on one CD! too much info. It would take many many CD's to encompass the web info.
(NancyL) Perhaps we could be selective.
(NancyL) I think, for instance, the GIFs of how to build a wood gas engine are excellent, should be in many hands!
(NancyL) The web site is 100 MB, or so, so is VERY recordable.
(NancyL) CD's can also be mailed relatively inexpensively, as they are paper thin, etc.
(Roger) I think that the project has merit and a committee could be formed, but it may not have time to come to fruition.
(Brent) Really? I thought much more info!
(NancyL) Hey, lets suggest Mike head it! His idea, and he is a technical wiz!
(NancyL) Propose options to the Board, we can even vote on this via email between meetings!
(SteveH) If he want's to do it all the more power to him!
(NancyL) Do CD's have hypertext? If so this is easy, any external link will just 404, and it is only a matter of doing a copy!
(Brent) Shirley - why do we need a project when info is public domain and folks can copy and back it up themselves?
(NancyL) I suspect there are CD copying places that mass produce too!
(SteveH) I'm not sure there would be much demand as we already have a book, website etc. but there may be some who are interested
(Roger) The hypertext is a result of the reader. If you make the whole business a Word doc or a pdf, the links should work if the viewing pc is connected.
(NancyL) Brent, I have a max, so keep track of this. There are things like then endless photos lately there are pigs, but if one bypasses that, sticks to survival which is what they are looking for, SMALL!
(NancyL) Roger, I bet if you just copies the web hypertext, and grahpics, one could pull this up on a PC browser easy!
(NancyL) This is almost more universal that .PDF and word DOC is specific to applications. Also, the hypertext requires no changes.
(NancyL) To do a .PDF of the web site, couple weeks of dedicated work!
(Brent) As Shirley said, I think Mike was thinking that folks would burn cd's on their own...find thier own info.
(NancyL) Steve, I think what they are looking for is a copy of the survival info on the web site, those long pages of excellent authorship, etc.
(NancyL) MORE than the booklet. Web Whacking costs $25 or so application, and many do not have the expertise to run this.
(Roger) Right, I wasn't thinking of that.
(NancyL) Web Whacking is a copy in your PC, not portable. Many do not have CD burners either, but can read them.
(NancyL) I frankly think a complete copy of the web site on a CD (external links would not work) would be easy to put together! I'd help.
(Brent) Do you want to approach Mike L on this Nancy?
(NancyL) I'll post this on tt-inc!
(NancyL) I have a Britannica set of CD's and they seem to have hyperlinks, work that way.
(NancyL) The way the web site is setup, it uses relative referencing all over, did that on purpose so it never goes outside of the home web hosting site.
(NancyL) SO, the browser would go back to look in the CD for the next page, the graphic, etc.
(NancyL) What I'm saying is, the web site as is CAN be just dumped to a CD!
(Brent) Nancy, post to TT Forum also, OK?
(NancyL) I think the problem folks had with web whackers is that they want to follow every link, thus go external, and it was endless thus.
(NancyL) Dumping the content of the directories limits that.
(NancyL) Brent, if you are going to post, can you do both? We are looking for a technical review of the method, to start.
(NancyL) I will create the dump and burn a CD (I have a CD burner here, never used it, but will learn) as an offer, if the technique is approved.
(Brent) Nancy - you said above that you were posting right away to TT inc....I just thought you could CC tt forum.
(NancyL) OK, I'll do both :-)
(NancyL) So much for upward delegating.
(Brent) hehehe :)
(Brent) OK, we're throwing this out to the membership (tt-inc) and tt forum....do we need to vote, or just see where it goes first?
(NancyL) As long as there are no objections, no vote is required, I think.
(SteveH) I think it's fine to go
(Roger) It was just a review item on the agenda. I think we have a direction and this is exploratory at the moment anyway
(NancyL) We're not spending funds, etc, just coming up with a plan.
(Roger) Right, until we need to buy cd's etc, this is just trying out an idea (proof of concept?).
(Brent) True....OK, sounds good. We will review progress next meeting then!
(Gerard) going to my sister now . k ?
(Brent) OK, Gerard...thanks. are you sending Shirley the log?
(Brent) or Nancy?
(NancyL) I will send her the log.
(Gerard) and i have a backup
(Roger) bye Gerard
(SteveH) I'm going to start getting ready for work but will stay logged on until I have to leave
(Brent) Shirley says - thanks Nancy & gerard
(Brent) OK steve
(SteveH) bye Gerard
(Roger) We're just about done...
(Brent) yes, 2 more items...
(Brent) Item 4 quick projects review....
(Brent) Roger, acerage project?
(Roger) Not much to review. It was a nasty season. The drought kept things from establishing, and then the dampness late in the season sort of finished off what was left.
(Roger) We never could get the beans going and the tomatoes suffered fungus and other afflictions.
(NancyL) I also have very very little seed production, pathetic.
(NancyL) Beans are tiny, got OUT what I put IN, about.
(Roger) The potatoes are way undersized and are just going to be mulched to hold them over to next season.
(NancyL) Herbs too, barely flowered, some even died.
(NancyL) Onions I purchsed in the store for seed I thought died, now they think it is spring and are growing!
(Brent) Hmmm....drought took it's toll then...
(NancyL) The only thing my gardens did well with were the concord grapes, they did well!
(NancyL) Sun burned things too, badly.
(NancyL) I sent out over 120 Seed Packets, Restart Your Garden, have 30 left but no longer getting requests.
(NancyL) Should folks get concerned, I expect old letters to activate, and get requests.
(NancyL) Got some real compliments on the message boards about this, by the way, from recipients.
(Roger) Stan has constructed a couple of cold frames that fit over an entire 30 foot bed. He has a nice set of lettuce and such that might survive into the winter. This isn't for seed production, but a good exercise for the acreage site.
(Brent) OK, thanks for the acerage/seed report....mabe requests will pick up in the next months...
(Brent) Shortwave report from Shirley....
(SteveH) I'm back
(Brent) Shirley says: Things are more or less the same as they have been for the past few months. I have managed to snag a free radio tower. Unfortunately, I have nowhere to put it right now. Our club is getting into shortwave packet. (more)
(Brent) As soon as I can persuade someone to build me an interface for the small radio I will try and get into it as well. right now, there are a few problems with computer speech synth. software and packet formats which have to be resolved. end of report.
(SteveH) I bought a handheld shortwave radio about 6 months ago
(NancyL) None here.
(Roger) Good work Shirley. Execellent snag with the tower!
(NancyL) You know, once on Lou Gentile hour a month or so ago, this was their short wave kickoff!
(SteveH) Does not have much range though, only field of view basically
(NancyL) 7.385 mHz, and some listened to it over short wave!
(NancyL) I was hopeful it was the start of a larger network, re survival.
(Brent) OK, thanks Shirley. Server report.
(SteveH) I have to run off now all
(Roger) See ya Steve, thanks for joining us.
(NancyL) Bye Steve!
(Brent) Buy Steve, thanks...
(Brent) Did Steve leave a proxy vote?
(Brent) I don't think he did.....
(Roger) No, he neglected that.
(NancyL) He said before the meeting started, when I mentioned leaving you his proxy, np, meaning no problem.
(Brent) oh OK, then I'll use it.
(NancyL) (NancyL) Steve, if you have to bolt, you could give Brent you proxy vote on any outstanding issues, then we can complete.
(NancyL) (SteveH) np
(Brent) moving right along....server project
(NancyL) Everyone was there, as I recall, when this was said.
(Brent) not much to report here. Since Jurian assied in the install of basic Linux software, I have had no one to help set up the necessary server sovtware and configuration to link to the others. I'm in a bit of a quandry as to how to proceed from here.
(Brent) Until I get some help or suggestions as to how to proceed, the server sits idle. end of report.
(Brent) Comments or suggestions?
(NancyL) Find a local hack :-) Send your daughter out to the techical schools to bat her eyes at the hackers :-)
(NancyL) Just kidding, but a LOCAL person would be ideal!
(Brent) :) yes, a local professional would be of help, but knowing how to link to Zetatalk / TT is a bit more difficult...or mabe that's just my perception.
(Roger) Finding someone we can trust is problematic. The university linux usersgroups might have several interested toying with it, but they might also leave backdoors, etc. to use it for their own interests as well.
(Brent) Roger, true. We certainly don't want any hidden backdoors!
(NancyL) Setting it up as a mirror site can be done via ftp, once the web hosting is a platform, NOT a problem and done from here!
(Roger) I know of a linux user who was quite good (gifted actually), but he has moved on to MIT and I'm not sure how to contact him at the moment. I'll do some checking to see if I can find him and get back to the list or the next meeting.
(NancyL) The email use, perhaps supporting chats, whatever, that's the tricky part.
(Brent) Nancy - is ther any other special software needed to set up ftp, or other links to become a mirror site?
(NancyL) I think the software you have includes all that.
(NancyL) It is configuring it, assigning a name to the system, partitioning, etc, that requires a hand.
(NancyL) Jurian did this for a living, so really knew his stuff.
(Brent) No, the software he had me install was just the basic Linux OS, nothing else. The partitioning, assigning a name, etc is done, but that's it.
(NancyL) All I know is that I linked Jurian up, via my PC and some software that handled TCP/IP connections, and he spend 25 hours configuring.
(NancyL) So what he DID during those 25 hours, I'm not sure.
(Brent) 25! ouch! Well, we'll just have to look for professional help, either locally or through member connections.
(Brent) OK, shall we move on to Item 5?
(Brent) Independent printing of booklet...comments or questions?
(NancyL) Yes, this is my agenda item ..
(NancyL) Couple years ago we were approached by someone wanting to print the booklets off, run a printing press.
(NancyL) Brent and I and others kind of instinctively forze on that, sensing others would put it out for sale, etc., and declined this.
(NancyL) But as I recall, we were taken by surprise.
(NancyL) At the time, we HAD time, to print and distribute, and by charging $5 per booklet could continue indefinitely.
(Brent) As long as there is free distribution, I see no problem. bEsides, the booklet is printable for free right from the website PDF.
(NancyL) But what I am thinking, say, theoretically, we get a sudden move toward rotation slowing (it is moving in that direction, by the way).
(NancyL) Rog took the PDF's to Kikos and within days these became booklets.
(NancyL) What if All manner of semi-well off folks want to do this for their city or employees or whatever?
(NancyL) If they leave the content intact, do not charge whom they give it to (no profit or sharking) then it is kind of like a donation.
(Roger) As long as they don't represent the booklet as their own work and/or charge for it, I don't see a problem with that.
(NancyL) If we were approached, do we have a POLICY on this? I think not.
(NancyL) Can we develope a policy here, in case this is a short notice issue?
(Brent) Do we have a copyright notice on the booklet?
(NancyL) Correct, as anyone can NOW print for themselves, then as long as funds are not collected as a result of printing/distribution, same difference!
(Roger) The work is more of a edit rather than an authorship.
(NancyL) Brent, the booklet was not copyrighted, but common law copyright applies.
(NancyL) I checked for a statement re this, as often someone will say "reproduce in total and no charge for distribution" is OK.
(NancyL) However, I don't see we have that.
(Roger) It has been professionally printed and distributed through the US postal system.
(NancyL) My concern is being on the radio, like the next Gentile show which will be devoted to survival issues.
(NancyL) If it comes up, I'd like to SUGGEST that wealthy people, those in corporate management, whatever, DO this for their town or employees or whatever.
(NancyL) So much faster, so much more efficient.
(Roger) I agree
(Brent) OK, It would also seem that any "semi-well off folks" would have internet access, and just download and print the booklet. The physical printing was done initially for folks that had no internet access. A well off patron would be able to print right from the web, and distribute, no problem.
(NancyL) So the feeling here is that for me to suggest this is in line with the Board's understanding?
(Brent) Shirley says yes also
(NancyL) Then we've had kind of an informal Quorum comment as I also see no conflict in this.
(Brent) Could we add to the files " reproduce in total, and no charge for distribution" or some such?
(Roger) Do we need a formal vote to rubber stamp it?
(NancyL) I think we should do that, to the web site, as it kind of SUGGESTS to folks that they do this.
(NancyL) I move that we add to the Operations page, where the PDF files are found and can be downloaded, such a statement.
(Roger) I second that motion.
(Brent) Nancy - can we add it DIRECTLY to the content of the PDF files, so it is downloaded as part of the booklet?
(Roger) excellent idea!
(NancyL) Yes, and I suggest we put it in BOTH places!
(Brent) Good idea...Second?
(NancyL) I second that motion.
(Brent) Shirley Seconds
(Brent) All in favor of adding this text to the booklet pdfs vote yes, opposed no
(Brent) shirley: yes
(Brent) Steve (proxy) yes
(Brent) The motion carries, changes to be initiated
(Brent) Very good!
(Brent) Does this cover all of item 5?
(NancyL) Yes! Perfectly :-)
(Roger) Great meeting, I move we adjourn!
(NancyL) I second that motion.
(Brent) Great! The meeting is officiall adjourned. 50 minutes after the hour
(Roger) Have a great day all!
(Roger) I'm going to go enjoy an 80+ day in October!
(NancyL) Saying Bye bye guys, to get all that work I got myself into done :-).
Session Close: Sun Oct 19 14:50:00 2003